Bullying

[Miss Saturn]

Hi Gaer,

Maybe you were not aware of your more angry side because your Mars/Pluto is in the 12th (I think that's where your placement was). I was always told growing up I was too nice, always compromising all the time, I was always sensitive to what people said. I was this way for a very long time. Too long. Because I also had Mars in Aquarius square Uranus in Scorpio in my chart with my 7th house Pisces planets, this side of myself was left unintegrated completely into my personality. I would read the descriptions of it, and reject it as at that time it was not me, or who I thought I was. Psychologically for years it was unconscious, only in the last couple of years have I really recognised this self willed character underneath, who gets opinionated, and it's cage gets rattled very easily now. All the years of compromising especially to my mother and then bullying partner has left this aspect fuming, underneath. This is why now the slightest comment directed my way and if I see someone offending me I react way overboard to it. I do believe the aspect can counterbalance my more giving in qualities and over agreeable side. But because I am still finding it hard to give constructive expression to the aspect it comes out self righteous, arrogant, self willed etc.

 

[MantisReligiosa]

I think it can be a combination of things, but I say it always has to do with transits.

I was bullied all throughout high school, which coincided with transitting Pluto first squaring my Venus, then my Sun(in my natal chart, I have Sun conjunct Venus, on the DC). So Pluto was transitting my 4th house, squaring my Asc-Dc(with my Sun and Venus on it) axis.
This is a T-square formation, and as we know, T-squares backfire in the opposite point of the squaring planet, which, in my case, was the 10th house..so, yeah.
No regrets, though. what doesn't kill you makes you stronger, as they say..that's especially true for Pluto transits.

 

[Venusian Grin]

I've been bullied throughout school, now I don't get bullied anymore. Somehow, I do have difficulty trying to be friends with people the same gender. I have the grand cross in my birth chart. The planets that are mostly involved in the oppositions/squares are sun (taurus), moon (leo), saturn (aquarius) and pluto (scorpio).

When I look back now, I just wonder what I did wrong. Somehow, my mind is always telling me it wasn't my fault. I just didn't have the strength to stand up for myself. It didn't help, the way my parents were tough on me, when I got bullied. I never got much support, my dad wouldn't do anything about it, he would tell me to go tell mum or he would tell mum himself, then my mum would get all angry that I've been bullied. I would get a yelling at or beating.

This has ruined me badly. Most of the time I tell people to "GO away and leave me alone" or I just ignore people. I can be a really happy or really down person. This had a big effect on my mood swing.

Is there anyone out there who has the same experience?

 

[JayM]

Happened to me before highschool in grade 7 and 8 because I was in a bad school (so I was told later), if it was transits I think transiting pluto was going over my uranus and my merc which are in my 10th (im 26 now and my natal pluto is 4 degrees scorpio in the 8th).

I was very shy at the time, and I have mars is in pisces, 1st in a trine less then 2 degrees with my pluto in scorp in the 8th (mars is intercepted because pisces is squished in the first, as my AC is aquarius), also saturn in scorp is square my venus, AC and opp my moon, so shy and mars wasn't helping back then although Im not sure if being intercepted has anything to do with it.

Power games have to do with something that you can hold over someone (or something you have that others dont), in the case of school social skills can be it but its not the only thing, bullying is also about powerlessness in the bully because they try to get a rise out of you.

I dont know if it is saturn or pluto but they both might have something to do with it, I have been bullied and I have hard saturn aspects and easy pluto aspects but my pluto is very dignified.

 

[bigblack]

I thought I would pitch in my two pennies worth.

But first I have only skimmed this thread. So those accuracy fascists and off subject fascists you are warned.

I think that there is another element here that has not been mentioned. This is being born different. Most interpretations are from the point of view of normality ie a normal person commenting on what its like for a normal person to be bullied. But what as I have mentioned if the person is just different. In this case according to the social rules and as bart simpson once put "always pick on the one who is different". Of course this is not about astrology - although it may be explained by the chart. Deformity can do it quite nicely. But would uranus and neptune be involved in some way. I have netune conj the asc(appearence) in the twelve and uranus in virgo in the tenth(reputation).

 

[Ruka_5]

What in a chart do you think indicates someone who has a tendency to be bullied?

Bullying is about abuse of power so I suspect a negative Pluto and Mars influence. People who are bullied often, but not always, have poorer social skills than the norm (making them "outsiders" and hence more likely to be victimised) so I expect to see this in the chart as well.

I think it's Pluto, too.

I have Mars-Pluto, Moon-Pluto, I've always attracted bullies and still do.

 

[danashock]

I will definitely have to say scorpio rising and/or pluto aspecting the ascendant. This makes people project their dirt on the person with these placements. and yes i think you are right,mars/pluto can is directly related to the issue but i feel that mars/pluto is bullying on steroids usually,as it is very often found in the charts of both criminals and victims!

 

[virgo18]

It is tricky to spot astrologically who is prone to be a bully or a bullied.

People might say generally, is an issue about Mars, Pluto, Aries, and Scorpio.
And the ones who suffer it will have a strong Moon, Neptune, and could be also Pluto that will play like a double edged sword... because pluto can be extremely sensitive or insensitive depending on the planets is aspecting.

Other People say that Mars in Libra or Cancer will be prone to be bullied... but I really don't think that a weak Mars is the fault of it. You have to check all the chart.

This issue is about psychology and family environment of either (bully and bullied)... And I will related to the 3rd, 1st, 4th, 5th, and could be 2nd. The planets which are there and the rulers. As well as Mercury, Mars, Moon, Sun, and Venus. (Also how the outer planets are affecting them)

Why the bullies bully? Because much of them have an Ill family environment (check 4th and Moon), there can be violence(Mars), their parents may regard them with material stuff to compensate their absence (2nd Venus), parents are very busy (Saturn), parents may give them incorrect advices (Mercury), father hits mother, superficial spiritual education (Jupiter). Also parents may feed their ego (5th and Sun) incorrectly (1st or 8th, Mars or Pluto). THEY GROW WHITH MUCH ANGER (MARS PLUTO), OR INCORRECT OFF THE CHARTS SELF WORTH (MARS) AND STEEM (SUN)
Also they are always insecure about their own attributes that's why they are always proving their own selves molesting people who appear weaker than them. They will NEVER bother people who appear stronger, because of their own fear to bring down all the self esteem. Instead they will have the need to develop a superficial friendship relationship with such people to feel more powerful. Also this guy may not treat good animals, plants, subordinates, and their own stuff. The things is that sooner or later in adult life, working environment, or romantic relationships someone will "BRING DOWN THEIR EGGS" (Spanish quote when someone breaks your superficial self esteem, or arrogance)


Why the bullied are bullied? Because of an obsessive overprotective mother (Moon-Pluto) that do everything for her child not letting it to develop self-sufficiency. The child will not develop social skills and will appear over emotional and insecure when its away from the mother... The perfect spot for a bully. They will also have an affected 2nd and 5th house by outer planets which block self worth and self-esteem. They mother wont let them feel emotional pain, or she will tell them everyone is a good person. So the child will not develop emotional strength, or cleverness to deal with difficult people and situations.
Maybe the family will cause some blockages in them telling things like: "You can't do this, you can't do that... you will never achieve this and that"
This kids will meet their first painful experiences in school, and they grow up fearing large groups of people and also school, as they experiment their first wounds in it. THis child can also turn into a bully when it grows up, and cause damage to other people.


The child will need balance.

So if you don't want your kid to be a bully or a bullied. Check your own natal chart and Learn to give them "balance". Half of independence, half of affection. And be aware how you ARGUE with them. Try to be not very rude, and not very soft. Just squared.
The character and either strength/sensibility of the child need to be developed since it is a baby and they have to go hand to hand.

Check which are your weak points in your natal chart and try not to discharge them with your future kid.

 

[Ruka_5]

I will definitely have to say scorpio rising and/or pluto aspecting the ascendant. This makes people project their dirt on the person with these placements.and yes i think you are right,mars/pluto can is directly related to the issue but i feel that mars/pluto is bullying on steroids usually,as it is very often found in the charts of both criminals and victims!

...I actually think that extends to anyone who has Pluto prominent or highly active in their chart in some way, whether it's aspecting angles, luminaries, or inner planets as well.

Pretty much all my life at various points I've been singled out, demonized and targeted by people. As a kid and even up until the last few years of my life, I largely blamed myself for it because I didn't know any better, I didn't know anything about projection so I went based on the external feedback I was getting and figured that since I keep having such negative experiences with people, I must be the bad one and the problem. I spent a lot of time beating myself up mentally and jumping hoops trying to please people and change myself because of it.

Once I learned a bit about human nature and the human psyche and my astrological knowledge grew, then I sat down and did the math about my own behavior. I realized there was nothing I was doing to justify any of the hostile and/or predatory behavior I'd been on the receiving end of, and that it had to be something else going on, something that had nothing to do with me.

I think Plutonian people end up being lightning rods unfortunately. A lot of people have unresolved Plutonian issues, some that aren't even aware they have those issues in the first place, or they've deeply repressed them. So then a Plutonian person walks past them and they immediately project all that energy onto them and in their mind, it suddenly becomes that other person that is the problem. At which point they prey on and terrorize the Plutonian person, in an subconscious attempt to fix themselves.

If they manage to successfully beat the Plutonian person into submission, (whether through words, fists or some other means), they go into a state of peace and contentment, which doesn't last long because, unbeknownst to them, that other person wasn't the problem in the first place, the problem is what's going on inside them, which still isn't resolved or healed. Those issues then eventually become a primary problem again and usually get vomited out onto the next Plutonian person that comes along and they then continue the cycle.

Once I really understood this, my whole approach to these situations, changed. Rather than try to defend myself, thinking that would make them back off (it doesn't; if anything, they use it as confirming 'evidence' in their own head that you are the problem and continue or even escalate their abuse) I know now to just completely ignore it and outright refuse to respond or engage them in any way. When you just don't acknowledge them at all they eventually move on and, unfortunately, target someone else.

 

[bigblack]

Generally speaking those who are picked on are different. Whether anyone here cares to admit it or not. Those who are picked on still want to be part of the pack/majority so even those who are different will readily use the points that those who are not different will use to describe the situation. I also feel that those who are different are usually completely surrounded by the majority, so thay are unable to form independent thought and/or theories as to why it is happening.

I will not do this. I know I am not usual and am not in denial or use the terms that the majority uses.

Its all uranus/neptune not pluto/neptune/moon.

 

[Still thinking]

This is just very simple.

Criticizing somebody is a nature of Saturn.

i see enemies,strangers and outsiders from 6th house. If 6th house is somehow connected with Saturn then you may be bullied by someone.

so many have not mentioned their birth details so i can't see by INDIAN METHOD.

Two horoscopes i saw just now was of Leo rising and Virgo rising who were once bullied. Reason is lord of their 6th house is Saturn.

One was Scorpio rising. This person was bullied at home not outside because for Scorpio rising Saturn is lord of 4th house.4th house stands for family and home environment.

 

[Venusian Grin]

This is just very simple.

Criticizing somebody is a nature of Saturn.

i see enemies,strangers and outsiders from 6th house. If 6th house is somehow connected with Saturn then you may be bullied by someone.

so many have not mentioned their birth details so i can't see by INDIAN METHOD.

Two horoscopes i saw just now was of Leo rising and Virgo rising who were once bullied. Reason is lord of their 6th house is Saturn.

One was Scorpio rising. This person was bullied at home not outside because for Scorpio rising Saturn is lord of 4th house.4th house stands for family and home environment.

I have saturn in 10th house. My ascendant is Aries. Both my saturn and 10th house are in Aquarius.

 

[Still thinking]

Reply to Venusian Grin

I follow Indian Astrology.i may need your complete birth details.

Saturn in 10th or 1st house give people suspicious nature.

saturn in 10th its own sign make people Hard worker.They do their task in a very systamatic manner.

This suspicious nature don't give them strightforward behaviour.they play good trick to know hidden truth.

Saturn in 10th may give you critizing nature.

i follow sign-house system.As per that your Saturn is in 11th house and aspectes your Aries rising.this increses your agressive thouths and make you highly rebelion.

 

[Venusian Grin]

I think you described my suspicious side really well!

I follow Indian Astrology.i may need your complete birth details.

Saturn in 10th or 1st house give people suspicious nature.

saturn in 10th its own sign make people Hard worker.They do their task in a very systamatic manner.

This suspicious nature don't give them strightforward behaviour.they play good trick to know hidden truth.

Saturn in 10th may give you critizing nature.

i follow sign-house system.As per that your Saturn is in 11th house and aspectes your Aries rising.this increses your agressive thouths and make you highly rebelion.

 

[Still thinking]

I may not be fully correct about Aquarians but i think they are nice people but not open minded.

Aquariuans and capricorn both are ruled by saturn so it's natural both wil have traits of Saturn.but after all they both are two different sign so there must be difference between them.

symbol of capricorn is half crocodile and half deer.Exactly i don't know.

We have observed crocodiles. How they pretend to be calm but inside they are waiting to attack.Due to this capricorns understand the TRAP system very well.

And if we we find moon and saturn in capricorn then that person may be highly suspicious and will always be in a fear that people are trying to Trap him.

As per my knowledge capricorns are mean.

 

[Still thinking]

As per Indian/vedic Astrology

http://leogold.com/OnlineHoroscope/...d;Dunedin;;;45:50S;170:33E;180E;Standard Time

As per this Horoscope you have saturn in Capricorn in 10th house and aspected by moon from 4th house.

 

[Still thinking]

i must thank you for starting this subject of bully.Because when you asked then only i started thinking.

I visited my friends's house.i felt she was not treated well.But now i realize that she was Libra Rising which means lord of 4th house was saturn.

 

[Cold Fusion]

If you go by fixed stars, then this can answer alot, I don't think polis is truthful.

Spiculum
The Lagoon Nebula Eye trouble, blindness, depression, hopelessly doomed, morbid religious outlook, no concern for human life; a nebula in the upper part of the Bow of the Archer. 1° Cap 04 1° Cap 12 Unfortunate Mars/ Moon M8 Sagittarius
N (red) Mg.6.0

Alnasl Eye trouble, blindness (or bad eyesight). A double star, with other weaker companions, in the middle of the Bow of the Archer. 1° Cap 16 1° Cap 24 Unfortunate Mars/ Moonγ (Gamma) Sagittarii
K0 (orange) Mg.3.1

Polis
A Foal Martial desires, high ambitions, domination, keen perception, success; horsemanship, truthfulness; spiritual power. A double star at the top of the Bow of the Archer 3° Cap 13 3° Cap 21 Very Fortunate Jupiter/ Marsμ (Mu) Sagittarii
B8 (blue) Mg.3.0 var.

 

[Flowergirl]

Two people I know who love to bully, criticise and disempower have Pluto in the first house and personal planets in Cap. It always amazes me how these people tend to get away with the bullying and how the bullying is often so low key and at such a psychological level and so damaging to other's self esteem. It is like this, they have been criticised so much about their bullying, that they revert to other under-cover, decoy-types-of-ways to bully.

Often when you are at the receiving end of bullying, it is hard to understand how people can do these things. It baffles the brains really.

 

[JayM]

I was also thinking and I have libra on the cusp of my 8th house and my 1st house venus in aqua is square saturn in the 9th in scorp, some of the bullying I have seen has been where people will pretend to be your firend but they will spread rumors about you or try to show you up or humiliate you in front of others. I also have cancer on the cusp of my 5th and 6th house and my taurus moon in the third opposes saturn, which is my cap suns ruler and my aqua AC's ruler.

The cusp of the 8th house colors the 8th house influences so an afflicted 8th house ruler might show bullying in whatever form it might take.