Fame in Britney Spears' Nativity (traditional perspective)

[Dima Gur]

Hi everyone,

In a lesson I've ran today a student asked a good question.
How can we see "massive fame" in the chart of Britney Spears?
I was using Spears' chart as an example chart, but not for the topic of fame.
It's a good question, and not one I was able to answer satisfactorily.

Britney's time is ranked "A" by AstroDatabank, not bad.
https://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Spears,_Britney

**
positive / unclear testimony:
- Her L1 is in an angular house and applying by a sinister square to Jupiter.
- Fortuna in end of Placidus 10th is something.
- She has something which is rather similar to Doryphory. The Sun flanked by Jup, Sat and Mars being oriental. On the other side the inner planets Venus and the Moon, being occidental. Mercury is an exception here. Also only Sat is exalted, the rest don't excel by much in essential dignity. And Sun is the sect light - not in favor in a night chart.
- Sun is cnj. Antares, but it has a mixed influence of good and bad (also evident in Spears' case). May contribute to fame I suppose.

negative / unclear testimony:
- The ruler of her 10th is peregrine, although in the good 5th house.
- Jupiter in the 2nd shows riches, but not necessarily fame.
- NN in the 10th is more indicative of wanting to be famous, but success in such cases isn't guaranteed.
- Calculated the part of fame (AC+Sun-Jup in a night chart), and got 11 deg of Scorp; a 10-deg orb cnj to Jupiter, in the 2nd. Ruler is Mars in hayz, but in the unlucky 12th. Seems okayy to me, not sure if more than that.

Summary:
With the amount of fame (both good and bad) Britney received, her chart doesn't seem to reflect that, all that well.

What do you think?
Anything else you've noticed?

 

[Sunrise]

I will agree and add that progressive systems also play a role. So the reputation may have come through progressive systems in combination with the transits.

 

[Nailu]

Hi Dima,

Did you see the thread on Britney Spears on here: https://astrologyweekly.com/threads/britney-spears.139721/ maybe it has something for you(r student).

Maybe it starts with the observation that her chart is almost a 180 degree turn from a standard natural chart with 0 Aries on cusp one. In some way one can read that switch as being an embodiment of the outside world. Having inside that what naturally flows outside. Turning her inside out as well. We saw that in different forms with her.

Where would you look in the chart to find her fanbase?

Saturn in Libra is exalted using Ptolemaic dignities. In the first house, trine the Moon, ruler of the MC, be it a bit wide with 7 degrees of orb.
Moon/Saturn know 'the time' possibly how to play it.

Arabic lot for Succes (Fortuna - Jupiter) is conjunct the MC: succes as an artist can very well include/lead to fame?
Would you count the sextile/trine from the lot of fame to the ascendant and MC?


Fixed stars:
Terebellum conj. Venus
Propus Conjunct MC
Alkes Conjunct Mars

Like Antares they all have this doubled up idea of prominence and downfall.

It's stretches of the imagination (or almost), far fetched. In some way that is what fame is right. A 1000 little puzzle pieces neatly falling in place to have a 1 in a million (?) outcome on the earthly plain. Strengthening the idea that the evidence is in part further out there then only our planets and made up out of many small factors.

Last of my thoughts is about her parents and how the music industry works. People are made, it is unnatural by the very nature of that world. So although her chart should reflect the possibility to get famous, a certain amount of proof that she is malleable as a personality( in the direction of succes/fame ) may offer a puzzle-piece.

With this question, I take it that your student came up with his/her own homework - assignment for next week.

Good luck finding the answers.

 

[JUPITERASC]

Hi Dima, Did you see the thread on Britney Spears on here: https://astrologyweekly.com/threads/britney-spears.139721/ maybe it has something for you(r student). Maybe it starts with the observation that her chart is almost a 180 degree turn from a standard natural chart with 0 Aries on cusp one.

In some way one can read that switch as being an embodiment of the outside world. Having inside that what naturally flows outside. Turning her inside out as well. We saw that in different forms with her.Where would you look in the chart to find her fanbase?

https://astrologyweekly.com/threads/please-read-before-posting-on-this-board.120411/
HIGHLIGHTING FOR BEGINNERS
THAT the following sentence:
"..a standard natural chart with 0 Aries on cusp one.."
IS NOT TRADITIONAL ASTROLOGY

Saturn in Libra is exalted using Ptolemaic dignities. In the first house, trine the Moon, ruler of the MC, be it a bit wide with 7 degrees of orb.
Moon/Saturn know 'the time' possibly how to play it.

Arabic lot for Succes (Fortuna - Jupiter) is conjunct the MC: succes as an artist can very well include/lead to fame?
Would you count the sextile/trine from the lot of fame to the ascendant and MC?


Fixed stars:
Terebellum conj. Venus
Propus Conjunct MC
Alkes Conjunct Mars

Like Antares they all have this doubled up idea of prominence and downfall.

It's stretches of the imagination (or almost), far fetched. In some way that is what fame is right. A 1000 little puzzle pieces neatly falling in place to have a 1 in a million (?) outcome on the earthly plain. Strengthening the idea that the evidence is in part further out there then only our planets and made up out of many small factors.

Last of my thoughts is about her parents and how the music industry works. People are made, it is unnatural by the very nature of that world. So although her chart should reflect the possibility to get famous, a certain amount of proof that she is malleable as a personality( in the direction of succes/fame ) may offer a puzzle-piece.

With this question, I take it that your student came up with his/her own homework - assignment for next week.

Good luck finding the answers.

 

[Nailu]

Jupiterasc hi!

Thank you for pointing that out, I'll take that as a lesson (once more).
Darn, I was so happy I remembered not too mention Pluto like before hahaha.
I hope this light hearted reply is not taken for anything other then that for I like and respect your cleanliness in the traditional forum corner.

Any insights on miss Spears' fame from you?

 

[JUPITERASC]

Jupiterasc hi! Thank you for pointing that out, I'll take that as a lesson (once more).

I'm a student

Darn, I was so happy I remembered not too mention BLEEP like before hahaha. I hope this light hearted reply is not taken for anything other then that for I like and respect your cleanliness in the traditional forum corner.

Beginners are frequently unaware of
the distinction
between Modernistic Astrology
& Traditional Astrology

Any insights on miss Spears' fame from you?

since the data source is "..from memoy.." Rodden Rating A
i.e.
not from birth record
the time of birth is unreliable

.

 

[Nailu]

You are.
They are.
It can be.

Thanks Jupiterasc.

Hearty greetings,
Another student

 

[leomoon]

Fame in the natal chart I would look to EITHER ROYAL PERSIAN STAR "FOMALHAUT" 3 PISCES/3VIRGO (OPPOSITE) LOCATION AND/OR REGULUS.
SINCE BRITTNEY DOESN'T SEEM TO HAVE PISCES RISING, PERHAPS SHE DOES IN PARANS?

Antares (Anti-Ares) is more associated with violence or becoming involve with someone who is violent = so is a warning imo.

 

[JUPITERASC]

FIXED STARS & FAME https://www.constellationsofwords.com/regulus/
REGULUS was the leader
of the Four Royal Stars
of the ancient Persian monarchy
the Four Guardians of Heaven

The four stars
marked the cardinal points
with
Fomalhaut, Regulus, Aldebaran & Antares.

Aldebaran Watcher of the East
Antares Watcher of the West;
Fomalhaut Watcher of the South;
Regulus Watcher of the North.

.

 

[jams]

I've lost count of the amount of celebs that have sun conjunct mercury

 

[Ukpoohbear]

I've lost count of the amount of celebs that have sun conjunct mercury

Marilyn Monroe is another one.

Marilyn had it in her 11th house and Britney has it in her 3rd.

I would say the Sun-Mercury in 11th is undoubtedly a description for Marilyn’s collective appeal.

For Britney, Sun-Mercury in her 3rd will enhance her natural communication abilities, especially given its trine to her 5th house.

For both, I would say Sun-Mercury has given the gift of popularity.

 

[JUPITERASC]

I've lost count of the amount of celebs that have sun conjunct mercury

That's because MERCURY orbits SUN every 88 days
so SUN-MERCURY ASSEMBLY - aka conjunction
occurs more frequently in comparison with
VENUS, MARS, JUPITER & SATURN

i.e.
MERCURY conjuncts SUN every three months
&
when allowing the usual 11% orb
https://www.skyscript.co.uk/aspectorbs.htmlboth applying TO SUN & separating FROM SUN
then
each SUN-MERCURY conjunction occurs for twenty-three consecutive days
so
that's ninety-two SUN-MERCURY conjunctions annually

& also consider MERCURY RETROGRADES
2024: MERCURY was in retrograde from April 1–25
&
August 4–28

.

 

[Dima Gur]

Nailu:

Fanbase? interesting...
Maybe the 11th or ruler of the 11th (supporters and friends - kind of).
Maybe Venus (people we like) or the Moon (our popularity amongst the common folk, so to speak).

Arabic lot for Succes (Fortuna - Jupiter) is conjunct the MC
That's a big one - nice!
Missed it.
Definitely helps in giving one fame (unlike success, which can be dispute in the case of Britney, with all that bad press and scandals).

Thank you.

---

leomoon:

"Antares (Anti-Ares) is more associated with violence or becoming involve with someone who is violent = so is a warning imo."
Yes, plenty of scandal and trouble in her life.

---

Sun-Merc conjunctions aren't that statistically rare (compared to other planetary conjunctions), due to their astronomical proximity, or mercury's astrological retrograde yearly cycle.

 

[muchacho]

Hi everyone,

In a lesson I've ran today a student asked a good question.
How can we see "massive fame" in the chart of Britney Spears?
I was using Spears' chart as an example chart, but not for the topic of fame.
It's a good question, and not one I was able to answer satisfactorily.

[..]

Summary:
With the amount of fame (both good and bad) Britney received, her chart doesn't seem to reflect that, all that well.

What do you think?
Anything else you've noticed?

I suggest you try Ptolemy's rank of fame technique as explained by Zoller. It's very reliable.

But before you do that, you have to:

1) Switch to sidereal
2) determine her actual ASC
3) use dual house system to determine essential and accidental dignity
4) simply do the math.

It's all going to make sense.

If you need more help, let me know.

 

[muchacho]

[..]


I suggest you try Ptolemy's rank of fame technique as explained by Zoller. It's very reliable.

But before you do that, you have to:

1) Switch to sidereal
2) determine her actual ASC
3) use dual house system to determine essential and accidental dignity
4) simply do the math.

It's all going to make sense.

If you need more help, let me know.

Somehow I can't edit my post!?

3) use dual house system to determine meaning and accidental dignity, for essential dignity pay attention to mutual reception

 

[Diem11]

- Sun is cnj. Antares, but it has a mixed influence of good and bad (also evident in Spears' case). May contribute to fame I suppose.

You forget, whatever is conjunct Antares is also opposing Aldebaran.
Britney's Sun is opposing (i.e. casting its full rays upon) Aldebaran. Conversely, Aldebaran is doing the same with her Sun. This might be what you are looking for.

 

[JUPITERASC]

Somehow I can't edit my post!?

Forum recently was re-sold
https://astrologyweekly.com/threads/hello-all.152529/

I won't be responding to ANY postings asking for astrology help as there is no delete button anymore.

I used to delete postings for the following: If I made a mistake in my astrology calculations which can easily happen when you are rushing to give an answer to return back to work. The OP never responded back or replied in a very rude way, without even give a thank you for calculating their answer.

At Astrodienst, I used to take down my comments after posting if I felt my contribution was not accepted with a little gratitude or was openly opposed in an aggressive + hostile manner.

Some people don't like an answer you give them + lash out at you. I believe I should have the right to delete my comment to such people.

In conclusion, I'm not going to bother replying anymore unless it's chat threads where no reply or feedback is needed. Taking away the delete button is a form of censorship.

Response from the new owner is as follows

Basic members have a 24 hour window to edit but I have just bumped it up to the maximum I'm allowed of 48 hours.

seems the edit function is now only available to
those who pay for it
..

I'm not talking about the edit button but about the DELETE button.

Posts can no longer be deleted apparently
except by moderators
.

3) use dual house system to determine meaning and accidental dignity, for essential dignity pay attention to mutual reception